Tools, Glorious Tools! #10 (Part 4) - Shop Made Gear Cutters - Making 'Cycloidal' Cutters
Added 2020-08-23 20:27:07 +0000 UTCHi Folks,
Part 4 of the shop made gear cutter series is a deep dive on making 'cycloidal' profile gear cutters - do please enjoy!
Also, if you happen to be free for an hour or so this evening/morning at 6pm EDT (2200 UTC) be sure to drop in for the weekly Discord chat. Ask a question, share some pics of what you've been up to in the shop, or just come and say G'day. Details below on how to connect, if you've not yet checked it out.
Cheers,
Chris.
Connect to the Clickspring Discord: support.patreon.com/hc/en-us/articles/212052266-How-do-I-receive-my-Discord-role-
Direct links to the video -
Vimeo: https://vimeo.com/450881477/3ba675eff1
Youtube: https://youtu.be/8-eAhLGmsNQ
-------------- Video Notes: ---------------
Some top resources on Gear Theory:
John Stevenson Blog Post - http://metalwebnews.com/howto/gear/gear1.html
WO Davis – “Gears For Small Mechanisms”: https://amzn.to/2Yj2Ben
JM Wild - "Wheel & Pinion Cutting in Horology": http://amzn.to/2HI6ca9
"Gears and Gear Cutting", Ivan Law: http://amzn.to/2FKmaUI
Tony's gear videos: - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-XOM4E4RZQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds6qZ7Ss2fA
Stefan on sharpening with pro gear, and a discussion on profile error: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sxq5khqeWI
Mr Pete's Gear Videos -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMhYuXx35Ik
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12sdMFr5CNU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lPNqn8LU4Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQVUI1YhN0E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXU-URNdUFU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dipd0ohrYzg
Andy Pugh's Gear hobbing video's:
"The Watchmakers' Lathe " Ward Goodrich - https://amzn.to/2Wijchr
Hugh Sparks - https://www.csparks.com/watchmaking/CycloidalGears/index.jxl
"The Clock & Watch Makers Guide to Gear Making" Porter - https://amzn.to/2xuFP7I
Online Gear Generator: https://geargenerator.com/
Alan Pinkus’s Gear Generator - http://www.micro-machine-shop.com/gears.htm#Gearotic_Motion
Matthias Wandels gear generator: https://woodgears.ca/gear_cutting/template.html
(Amazon Affiliate links)
Cameras:
Panasonic GH5 - https://amzn.to/2rEzhh2
Panasonic X920 - https://amzn.to/2wzxxdT
Books:
"Wheel & Pinion Cutting in Horology": http://amzn.to/2HI6ca9
"Solidworks 2013 Bible": http://amzn.to/2FObS1D
WO Davis – “Gears For Small Mechanisms”: https://amzn.to/2Yj2Ben
"Workshop practice Series": https://amzn.to/2WgeGh0
Tools & Shop Products:
Sherline Lathe: http://amzn.to/2pnXM19
Sherline WW collets: http://amzn.to/2FYZ7F8
Starrett S828 Wiggler Center Finder With 3 Attachments - https://amzn.to/3hoAsK1
Optivisor Headband Magnifier: http://amzn.to/2HFg1FU
Norton 1-by-2-by-8-Inch Fine/Coarse India Combination Oilstone, Red: http://amzn.to/2tTEPb0
Hegner Scroll Saw: https://amzn.to/2IhteVW
Digital Caliper 6 inch/150 mm Electronic Vernier Calipers: https://amzn.to/2EArNRU
Generic Dial Indicator 0.001": http://amzn.to/2FOFTyF
Interapid Dial Test Indicator: http://amzn.to/2FPInwH
Saint Gobain (Norton) - 4 Arkansas Stones + case: http://amzn.to/2HCOAMX
Dormer A190202 Jobber Drill Set, 1.0 mm - 6.0 mm x 0.1 mm Size: https://amzn.to/2DR5fdb
Dormer A190203 Jobber Drill Set, 6.0 mm - 10.0 mm x 0.1 mm Size: https://amzn.to/2ITfeTa
YG1 NC Spotting Drill 8% Cobalt HSS 1/8 to 1/2" 120 Degree 5 Pc Set CNC Machine: https://amzn.to/2G7ylv6
Blazer GB2001 Self-Igniting Butane Micro-Torch: https://amzn.to/3f5Gzlh
Magnetic Base Adjustable Metal Test Indicator Holder Digital Level 14" - Tool Stand: https://amzn.to/2PkyoTV
Anytime Tools Angle Block Set 1°, 2°, 3°, 4°, 5°, 10°, 15°, 20°, 25°, 30° Precision +/- 20 Seconds, Machinist Tool, 10 Piece Set: https://amzn.to/2QFqM2Y
Jewellers Bench Block - https://amzn.to/3clHQD2
Consumables:
Super Pike Saw Blades Size 3/0 pkg of 144: https://amzn.to/2uI0QdT
Blue Matador Abrasive Paper: https://amzn.to/2IAFiBT
Bergeon Professional Cleaning Rodico: https://amzn.to/2NwcM6y
Dykem 80300 Steel Blue Layout Fluid, Brush-in-Cap (4oz): http://amzn.to/2HGPaJJ
Comments
For the cycloidal wheel & pinion cutting, I think I will make a button cutter and use one side only, and offset by 2 deg as explained ... Gives me an excuse to make all the jigs & fixtures ... Excellent gear calculator sheet!
Adam Gill Creations
2023-05-13 08:43:25 +0000 UTCChris, when making the four faces on the cutter with the end-mill I see the one dimension to be on line with the center of the cutter, but I can't find a reference to depth of cut with the end-mill, it looks to be about in line with the indexing hole center but I'm not sure of this. Maybe it's not critical.
Rod Cole
2023-03-10 12:59:45 +0000 UTCI can't find the "T" Tooth Cycloidal Wheel that you have in the green heading. With some help from a Lodge Brother I got the excel spread sheet to open in my MacBook Air but now I can't find the cycloidal department. I'm looking to make the gears for the Skeleton clock~. Never mind, I found it - I was beginning to feel stupid, and did some more looking - low and behold, there it was!!!
Rod Cole
2023-03-08 18:45:08 +0000 UTCHello mate, yes send a pic to chris@clickspringprojects.com and I'll see what's up - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2022-08-05 00:08:46 +0000 UTCHello Chris, I am still having an issue with the excel file, and now I can't get my infeed values. Is there another way for me to calculate them? My lathe is all zeroed in, if you know what I mean. I took a screenshot if you want to see. I think the columns are not wide enough for all the numbers. Thanks!
Eric Maillet
2022-08-04 23:29:38 +0000 UTCBe sure also to use decimal point rather than a comma for the decimal - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2022-07-24 00:23:39 +0000 UTCHey Chris, thanks for your reply. It doesn’t show as a number. It gives me a VALUE! alert. I’ll check the file. Might be a version issue. Thanks again!!
Eric Maillet
2022-07-23 23:57:59 +0000 UTCHi Eric, the 'Fillet radius r' (for round bottom cutters) is the value you are looking for, its the field just below the 'Number of Teeth T'. This radius is also illustrated on the section view sketch so you can visualise it - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2022-07-23 22:12:20 +0000 UTCHi Chris, Sharpening tool done, cutting arbor done, cutter blank done. So far so good. I am starting work on my buttons for the form tool. I need to cut Module 0,148 , 70 tooth mainspring barrel for a watch. Calculations in your excel sheet work fine except I cannot get a round bottom radius value because the sheet does not give me one. Does that mean I cannot cut a round bottom? It doesn't really matter in the end since the meshing will work fine, but I just wanted to make sure I had the numbers right.
Eric Maillet
2022-07-23 19:33:43 +0000 UTCHello mate, yes I think that is the name - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2021-04-30 21:00:56 +0000 UTCHi Chris, Thank you so much for doing theses. It is fantastic! is that what you would call a cone runner, coming from the tail stock to steady the pinion at around 16mins in?
Seán Ó Fearghail
2021-04-30 19:36:26 +0000 UTCYou should totally try using your brass gear cutter to cut aluminum. I mean, if copper chisels work on stone...
Reed Bowman
2021-02-08 06:11:43 +0000 UTCVery Nice! I've been looking for an approachable way to make multi tooth cutters for a while! I think you would get a better finish on the working profiles of your teeth if you honed the profiles of the cutter teeth as well. After all, it is that profile that will be imparted on the work.
Karl Mansson
2020-11-25 22:04:37 +0000 UTCCheers John :)
Clickspring
2020-09-08 04:13:40 +0000 UTCCheers mate!
Clickspring
2020-09-08 04:13:25 +0000 UTCThis is really interesting and encouraging. My machining skills are pretty basic, but I would like to be able to produce some gears at some point. You make it seem possible! Thanks!
John S Dilsaver
2020-08-29 16:55:31 +0000 UTCAnother excellent, informative video Chris! Every time looking forward to a new film. Thank you so much!
Joris van 't Land
2020-08-28 05:24:51 +0000 UTCThanks Chris I will look in to it.
Chris Schmedding
2020-08-26 23:14:23 +0000 UTCHi Chris, I get it from Ian Cobb in the UK: http://www.clockmaking-brass.co.uk/en8_steel.htmL - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-26 23:09:09 +0000 UTCHi Chris , where do you source your EN8 from if I may ask ?
Chris Schmedding
2020-08-26 22:46:44 +0000 UTCHi David, it depends a bit on the broader style of the mechanism - if its a highly finished device (but electoplating is not intended), then my preference is to get the parts to a highly polished state using Bill Smith's Rub-n-brite polish, and then simply leave them. Providing the surface is kept meticulously clean (free of fingerprints etc) then it will slowly form a nice dark patina. If the device is a little more 'everyday' with a brushed finish, then something like Renaissance wax is good. Again it slows and regulates the patination into something quite nice and uniform. The other option is electroplating with an inert metal like gold or rhodium - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-26 20:04:47 +0000 UTCHey Chris asan aside, when making clock wheels, once they are polished what coating do you give them so they keep their lustre?
David Few
2020-08-26 13:20:27 +0000 UTCIts a really hard question to answer Benjamin, because it depends on so many factors that will be different for each user - However personally, I use both my commercial and shop made cutters regularly for typical home shop work: one off projects, repairs, doing work for friends etc. Assuming that I look after them properly I do not expect to have to either re-purchase, or re-make a given cutter ever - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-25 20:17:39 +0000 UTCThank you!
Clickspring
2020-08-25 20:06:45 +0000 UTCVery pleased you enjoyed it mate! I may look at the Eureka tool in the future, but its not a priority at the moment. This method will sort out the cutter costs of most typical home shop projects, and it has the benefit of being very straight forward for even someone quite new to machining to implement - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-25 20:06:35 +0000 UTCIts a bit of both - this short series has been on the to-do list forever, but the next few years of projects pretty much requires that I get it done now - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-25 19:54:32 +0000 UTCYes I was aware that he had passed away - I never knew him directly, but like so many of the engineering writers of his calibre, I felt like I knew him from his work. His writing on technical matters is outstanding. Accurate, informative, economically written and easily applied. I very much wish I had had the chance to meet him in person.
Clickspring
2020-08-25 19:40:14 +0000 UTCGreat video! You mentioned that these shop made cutters should last about as long as a commercially made one if cared for properly. On average, how long exactly is that? In short, how often would one need to go through the trouble of making these?
Benjamin Marn
2020-08-25 19:07:27 +0000 UTCAnother superb video. My favourite YouTube channel without question.
rfproject
2020-08-25 17:51:57 +0000 UTCGreat to see another excellent video from you, especially on such an interesting topic. Have you considered diving even deeper into gear cutters and do a series on the Eureka form relief tool?
Tor Halsan
2020-08-25 12:52:57 +0000 UTCI note that you make reference to John Stevenson's excellent web pages above. I don't know if you know but John died last year I 'knew' John through various forums and exchanged messages. He could appear rather cantankerous but was helpful and generally courteous if treated with respect but didn't suffer fools gladly.
Terence Dixon
2020-08-25 09:53:02 +0000 UTCHi Chris,
Terence Dixon
2020-08-25 09:51:31 +0000 UTCAwesome to know. Cheers, Chris!
Justus Dehegovit
2020-08-25 06:18:06 +0000 UTCI’m curious, are you making these tools for a future project, or just adding to your arsenal of cutting tools and showing how you make them?
Thomas
2020-08-25 00:50:49 +0000 UTCWhich, for my fellow Americans, translates to 6pm EST, 5pm Central, etc etc. (Sorry, I couldn't help myself :)
Benjamin Marn
2020-08-24 22:48:15 +0000 UTCAh terrific, that is a huge reduction in work, well done. I am still working on the new platform - its taking a lot longer to build than I had hoped, but it is progressing. I will certainly let you know when it is ready for you to use - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 19:31:58 +0000 UTCHi Chris, thanks for the reply. The reason I wrote my initial comment was because I applied the theory you thought us in these videos onto my Astronomical clock project. The clock features 19 wheels, the lowest tooth count being 17, with almost every gear having a unique tooth count and size. Even when you apply the commercial involute cutter ranges, for these 19 wheels I would still need to make 15 involute cutters. On the contrary, if I made these gears cycloidal, which follows the original plans, I would only need 7 different cutters. Thats quite the difference. By the way, was the website for plans we talked about already announced or did it still need tweaking?
Justus Dehegovit
2020-08-24 18:15:25 +0000 UTCHello mate - Yes on the Cycloidal wheels only requiring the one cutter across the entire count range of 17 up to a rack, and yes pinions are a little more difficult but still fairly straight forward. For the Involutes you can certainly do a unique cutter for each count if you want to, but its not essential. It would be quite reasonable to take the same approach as we do for commercial involute cutters where a set of cutters span the full range, and each individual cutter accounts for a specific section of the range - for example a #6 cuts gears with counts 35 to 54 teeth, a #7 cuts 55 to 134 etc - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 11:25:19 +0000 UTC8am AEST on Mondays - catch you then Iain :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 11:14:11 +0000 UTCCheers mate :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 11:12:55 +0000 UTCCheers Erick :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 11:12:47 +0000 UTCHi Michael, yes I think I cover most of that here: https://youtu.be/bcfn28L2Jtw - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-24 11:12:38 +0000 UTCSo for Involute wheels, you would have to make a cutter (shank and pair of cutter buttons) for every wheel that has its own individual tooth count and size. Also pinion cutting is difficult (can you even make involute pinions?). Whereas in cycloidal tooth gears, as long as you only make wheels and no pinions, you can use one cutter for every tooth count, as long as it is the same tooth size/module. Pinions are a little bit more difficult, but also possible. This is interesting for clock gear trains, where gears often have to share coaxial shafts so many gear pairs come not only with their individual tooth counts, but also individual modules to manage the shared shafts!
Justus Dehegovit
2020-08-24 09:51:23 +0000 UTCIm sure I’m not the only dummy in the group but what time is the discord chat in Aussie time?
Iain Deas
2020-08-24 07:32:31 +0000 UTCGood to hear that voice again. Also, showing me how to properly cut gears at home. Next, SteamPunk gear!
Kevin Reardon
2020-08-24 00:47:53 +0000 UTCBrilliant.
Emalkartha
2020-08-24 00:13:55 +0000 UTCVery nice! Did you do a video showing the indexer at the back of the lathe and the "spinny bits" on the carriage?
Michael Lloyd
2020-08-24 00:13:54 +0000 UTCThank you mate, so pleased you're enjoying them :)
Clickspring
2020-08-23 21:08:38 +0000 UTCTGT is ever so satisfying Chris.... Well Done.
Robert D
2020-08-23 20:58:40 +0000 UTCAh, great, thank you. It looks so, well beautiful and clean, in the video. Makes sense, compressor oil is nice and light, See you. 👍🏼
Justin J.
2020-08-23 20:56:23 +0000 UTCI use a generic compressor oil - nothing fancy, just the sort you can pick up at any auto shop - Cheers :)
Clickspring
2020-08-23 20:53:32 +0000 UTCThank you mate!
Clickspring
2020-08-23 20:52:56 +0000 UTCHey Chris, if you don't mind me asking, what sort of cutting oil are you using when you machine the cutters? Or if it's already been mentioned maybe direct me to the right place? Thanks!
Justin J.
2020-08-23 20:50:33 +0000 UTCExcellent! More TGT!
Justin J.
2020-08-23 20:29:03 +0000 UTC
