Sales Tax
Added 2020-05-28 20:16:55 +0000 UTCHowdy folks,
This isn’t a chapter. Settle down. Settle….
Good, that’s better.
Okay, so, the folks over at Patreon say that they are going to be required by law to start charging sales tax depending on where you live, and what you are “getting” from your pledge. They sent me some boilerplate to send you, which I’ll tack on at the end of this. They are also going to send you an e-mail about this in a few days, but they want us creators to soften the blow for them or something, I guess, so here goes.
How it works on my end is that I have to define who gets what in terms of benefits for each tier. Depending on what the benefit is, it may or may not be taxable depending upon where you live. If you love math (Who am I kidding? You’re here. Of course you love math) and really care about the breakdown of the extra ten cents that this might cost you, here goes:
For example:
A Bronzeplate gets three “benefits” for their $2.50 pledge.
1) Advance Chapters (For tax purposes: “Early Access”)
2) Access to Discord (For tax purposes, “A private community” - Typically not taxed)
3) General support (For tax purposes: “A donation” - Typically not taxed)
Now, assuming that you value all of these things equally, that’s 83.33 (repeating, of course) cents per benefit. Yes, yes, I could go in and adjust things to weight it toward one of these categories, but honestly, you’re all just here for the Discord, right? Even split.
So, if you live somewhere that taxes “Early Access” goods at 10%, and doesn’t tax “donations” or “private community access,” that’s 8.3 cents of tax that you’d have to pay on top of the $2.50 pledge. So $2.50 becomes $2.58. Again only if you live somewhere that taxes that kind of thing.
Wow, why am I bothering to crunch these numbers again? Right, the higher tiers.
So, since I don’t give you anything for paying me more (I’m pretty rude, huh?), it gets classed under donation. Here’s the breakdown.
Silverplate ($5)
Advance Chapters: 83 cents
Discord Access: 83 cents
General Support: 334 cents
Goldplate ($10)
Advance Chapters: 83 cents
Discord Access: 83 cents
General Support: 834 cents
So, assuming you don’t live somewhere super lame, it is still 8.3 cents for the “early access”, and zero for the other two categories.
At least, that’s the theory.
Right, what was I doing? Oh yeah, editing the next chapter. Details below in the boilerplate if you want them.
--SenescentSoul
________________________
Sample post copy
Post title: An update on sales tax
Hi everyone,
I wanted to give you an update on some changes that we’ll be seeing which may affect some of your pledges. Due to new laws passing in several countries and US states, Patreon will be required to start charging sales tax on some pledges starting July 1st.
Less than half of all patrons will be charged sales tax, and for most, the amount will be very small. For example, sales tax rates in the US range from 4% to 11%, so on a $5 pledge, that would be between 20 cents and 55 cents.
Whether or not you will be charged sales tax depends on your location, and what is considered taxable there. Not every pledge is taxable, not all benefits are taxable in every location, and sometimes only a fraction of a pledge will be taxable. The money that Patreon collects as a result of these laws are paid directly to local governments.
I’m working closely with Patreon to ensure I’m able to save you as much money as possible when it comes to sales tax - which is not something that’s possible with other platforms.
If you’re in a location where sales tax will be required, you should expect to receive an email from Patreon with more information about this very soon, but I wanted to make sure you were aware of these changes way ahead of July 1st when they go into effect.
If you have questions, you should be able to find answers here. If you still have questions, the best place to get an answer is from Patreon’s customer support team, here.
Thank you for all of your support.
Comments
Already pay sales tax, it’s include in certain country like France
Samityaou
2020-05-31 09:34:28 +0000 UTCDoesn’t this post explain that people in higher tiers won’t pay any more tax?
Simon Casey
2020-05-31 05:15:26 +0000 UTCEarly access is still what you’re paying for, so why would a different delivery change anything? You would need to be a lawyer to know which such arguments are valid, and which means you’re breaking the law.
Chymor
2020-05-30 06:53:04 +0000 UTCDon't really care since I am a bronze plate, but it still sucks for the people who want to give you a little more.
NarielV
2020-05-29 22:36:00 +0000 UTCHoly cow. That's a hefty percentage. I hope your gov't puts it to good use.
Philip Pleiss
2020-05-29 11:59:13 +0000 UTCI need to check if my state (Nebraska) taxes "Early Access". Haven't checked in a while, but I think sales tax is still sitting around 5.5%.
Philip Pleiss
2020-05-29 11:52:32 +0000 UTC(UK) I already have been paying VAT on Patreon so nothing new here.
Rande Knight
2020-05-29 10:40:45 +0000 UTCNot really. If you sell books, VAT applys. If you sell books via subscription (kindle unlimited), VAT applys. If you sell books via patreon, why shouldn't VAT apply? Also, for EU, VAT is already deducted from the payments right now - the EU requires any listed price to include VAT, and patreon hasn't managed so far to seperate compensations for goods or services from pure donations with the European tax authorities, so VAT is deducted from every EU payment.
m2wester
2020-05-29 06:55:05 +0000 UTCthe rapacity of american fiscality is beyond reason.
Thenais
2020-05-29 05:26:53 +0000 UTCI personally do not have much problem with the tax, but if a large portion of the community takes issue with it, a possible solution you may consider is to release the chapter files on a role-locked Discord server, rather than on Patreon. Basically move 'early access' away from Patreon and on to Discord, while leaving 'Discord access' as a Patreon perk.
Muspellsheimr
2020-05-29 03:30:18 +0000 UTC*Panicks slightly* *huffs the pdf*
MitchyGoodness
2020-05-29 00:33:30 +0000 UTCFucking taxman
Sand Bear
2020-05-29 00:09:09 +0000 UTCso even a pledge gets taxed. I wish the government would F'off and keep its hands outside my wallet. Seriously this might just stop me pledging to so many things as it already costs WAY more than just buying the books at the end and is done more to provide support than benefit. however, If the government still want to steal their slice of cake, then I think I might just pay them once when I buy the end product. after all, I don't want to pledge money to an already overtaxing underperforming government.
Faruel
2020-05-28 23:11:58 +0000 UTCWow, I was paying tax on Patreon before tax was even a thing... I have 25% tax on Patreon.... SenescentSoul $2.50 per month for May* $0.63 $2.50
Tomislav Fistrić
2020-05-28 22:01:55 +0000 UTCYea but. When is the next chapter. :-P
Jeremy Humphrey
2020-05-28 21:25:37 +0000 UTCSo nobody mentioned the blatant self-praise patreon put in that sample?
Maximilian Hübner
2020-05-28 21:21:51 +0000 UTCIt reads like a normal chapter... minus Rain speculating and getting distracted.
Loipers
2020-05-28 21:16:51 +0000 UTCTo be honest, the early chapters are just a perk. I'm mostly in it to support good work. It's only fair to pay sales tax, and if the whole thing was taxable that would not really change the math for me. If I were you, I would bold the parts about how much extra people are going to spend, since it is so small, and be sure to emphasize that because of how the numbers work out, higher tiers tend to get charged less in USA.
Ryan
2020-05-28 21:05:22 +0000 UTCWell I'll keep supporting you and I I got to admit that is kind of dumb but they're charging you tax for a donation I mean this is a donation website sure some people offer Early Access or things like that but it's early access they don't charge you early access for playing a video game or anything like that so why should donations and chapters that'll be revealed in a day or two to be taxed sounds like more government greed to me but keep it up man of the story obviously wishI can see the next hundred chapters right now but takes time I'm with you have a good day
Steven Thompsen
2020-05-28 21:02:29 +0000 UTCSo, lemme get this straight: for the EU, Patreon simply introduced flat charges with VAT, no matter what benefits were included, while the US gets to pay less sales tax due to parts of the benefits being non-taxable? Now that's straight up stupid.
Yorumoto Akira
2020-05-28 20:39:59 +0000 UTCWait, some people didn't have to pay tax on patron? Cries in european
Ikawaii
2020-05-28 20:33:10 +0000 UTCIn unrelated news the Libertarian stance that all sales tax should be abolished suddenly gained mainstream popularity...
Adam Roundfield
2020-05-28 20:24:34 +0000 UTCLove the government plot development and the tech problems it brings. Keen to see where this goes.
2020-05-28 20:23:02 +0000 UTCWell I already paid tax on patron, so I don't think anything will change (Added Value Tax in France)
Alianok
2020-05-28 20:22:35 +0000 UTCPersonally I care only about extra chapters and supporting this story because its good!
2020-05-28 20:21:41 +0000 UTCHuh, ok
Ezio Azrael
2020-05-28 20:21:16 +0000 UTCHRNG. I'm settled. All settled... My re-reading the latest chapter is totally unrelated to my need of another fix of Delve.
Ziggy
2020-05-28 20:19:38 +0000 UTCOf course you would crunch the numbers for us 😅
Bloodorange17
2020-05-28 20:19:10 +0000 UTCToo long man 😆
Semsem
2020-05-28 20:18:46 +0000 UTCYou sure it isn't a chapter?
Semsem
2020-05-28 20:18:34 +0000 UTC