Patreon, R&P Q&A #244

I believe I haven’t been clear… it’s not just the swallowing it’s a blowjob or handjob to completion. I haven’t taken the time to think about it outside of swallowing. Seems like y’all are hung up on the swallowing maybe I’m wrong? I have never experienced anything outside of someone swallowing. To me it’s the act of making me cum outside of sex (in the mouth not in the mouth). Why is that important? Sometimes im stressed and need a bj. Seems that simple to me

Ate My Wheaties

Not sure if swallowing is a basic need…. When I was dating… found my wife. Her swallowing was not in the top 100 of qualities I was looking for. That’s me. I am not judging your checklist. I am probing: why is this a deal breaker for you? If you told me she had 10k of debt and could not hold down a job. I would understand.

Cousin Eddie

It’s an chemical engineering degree but I went out of state which was my mistake.

Flavor

It is. I honestly am having a hard time seeing anyone’s perspective here. I thought receiving a bj outside of the act of sex was a basic need for everyone. I am 36 most likely have had sex in the 3 digits and I have never come across this.

Ate My Wheaties

Swallowing cum is the line in the sand. That is on your checklist for a ltr? There are some underlying issues here. Or Is it me. I am not demanding enough.

Cousin Eddie

My spider senses are going bonkers. Do you have abundance with women? I am sensing, no. This could be prostitution. A bored maid with many situations, a woman looking for a provider…. A lawsuit.

Cousin Eddie

Try again. What do you want, what did you try?

Op Sec

MENTAL MODELS (LEW AND MEW) Okay, not a field report this week. These are thoughts relating to Rian's disagreement with Rollo on the existence of "Genuine Burning Desire." Here I outline the idea of the "Low Effort Woman" and the "Max Effort Woman." LOW EFFORT WOMAN A man is in a long term relationship, and things are not going well. Sex is non-existent, or rare and uninspired. She may go out of her way to make sure the logistics just don't work out. She doesn't do other things like back rubs, cooking breakfast, cleaning his (their) place. Her fashion sense is "feminist frump" and maybe she has short "Karen" hair. The Low Effort Woman is every day calculating the least amount of effort that it takes to maintain the situation, and applying only that effort. She could be planning to branch-swing, but she isn't ready yet. Maybe some women believe their own propaganda, and think they won't be able to maintain their life style if they divorce. Maybe there are social status benefits to being the one chick in her circle of friends, siblings and cousins who is still married. Also, we can't rule out the possibility that she wants out, but she wants it to be his fault. One wonders what the hell she is doing still there, but it probably doesn't matter. HIGH INVOLVEMENT WOMAN A man is in an LTR, or he has a woman who is highly motivated to stick around. She seeks an LTR. Sex is frequent; she buys lingerie, she dresses feminine, she cooks and cleans. When the woman who would later become my wife was making home made pies and fucking me while they were in the oven, she was a "Max Effort Woman," (MEW). Max Effort Woman carries on the interactions with her man AS IF she has Genuine Burning Desire. He sees a woman who is doing everything she can think of to further the goal of mate retention. I would argue that at some moments she has genuine burning desire. Most of the time she is thinking of and applying whatever mate retention techniques are within her ability and creativity. Perhaps it is a combination of good sex, validation, social status, and security that she seeks. The LEW is calculating the minimum effort to maintain the situation with a man she tolerates. The MEW aggressively and creatively retains a man she really wants.

Gearo's Journey

From my jv knowledge: you can revise payments based on income changes. But it takes work. Mfa means nothing in earning power. Absolutely zero. Ssri: Drs are criminally bad with chronic issues. All drugs are toxic and make your body weaker over time. Even if they mask symptoms. Sometimes they are needed. As in the stress of a divorce. 2years is enough. Just stick with it. Could take a week, a year or longer… just stick with it. Anger about cheating: burn that frame. I know it is hard but you were reacting. In her frame…. A function of her actions. Live your life and bask In abundance. Let her live hers. And deal with her consequences.

Cousin Eddie

Also, keep responses as replies to your comment. It helps keep things organized.

170 k! Wow! Indentured servitude. If you are living at home… most of that went to school fees not rent. Please say it is a good degree. I lived in a car during school. Pl not of friends and places to hang out at… shower. Went to the gym. Plenty of women. That is to much debt…

Cousin Eddie

Stone McKinley

Also, don't put your face in here.

Owning My Shit

It's your money and your time, but you'd benefit so much in not treating this place as a dear diary.

Owning My Shit

Stone McKinley

If this is something you want in a relationship long term, then this isn't the girl for you.

Op Sec

Yes I see her ability to push past in that moment. Ego? Because I enjoy it and want that in a relationship long term? I’m being honest when I’ve said this is the first I’ve even see this. I am open to it being an ego thing and not something I feel I need. Appreciate the potential scenario that helps a lot. And if it is a hard no then I need to make a decision if it really is that important to me long term correct?

Ate My Wheaties

Negotiated Desire: Listened to your field report review of Adonis last week and I believe I did something similar: On a double date with girl I’m plating and 2 friends of mine she just met. My Girl: Blowjobs are more intimate than sex (Other girl agrees) Me: So if im fucking you and you look me in the eyes and say “cum in me” “Say please” “Please” I cum deep inside you… that’s not too intimate? Both girls laugh and agree Me: Besides maybe if I’d finished in your mouth you’d have a case. Girls laugh There was a playful tone and it was off the cuff but teaching her a lesson? Back at my place before bed: Her: you really don’t think blowjobs are intimate? Me: What you do? No. If you’re not swallowing my cum I don’t think so. Would never date someone long term if they didn’t blow me to completion. Her: Crying/Hysterics Didn’t know it was that serious to her (the relationship and her inability to want to make me cum with her mouth). First words out of her mouth were “It would be a lot of work” which… Some context… I do like to fuck for a long time. Made a comment about how it would take her an “hour” Not sure if this is a real concern or she just doesn’t like seamen in her mouth. Next morning fucked… was getting out of bed took a dab of cum off the tip of my cock and went to put it in her mouth… *disgusted face… turn to get back up.. *grabs arm pulls me back around and sexily licks it off my finger… Guess it is a cum hang up? Which is weird to me, because pre cum there’s no issue and this chick has blown me after I fucked her on her period and when I said Id clean her blood off me she said “well you were tasting it when you went down on me” that’s not how that works but okay. Anyways, how should I have gone about this besides maybe just fucking her face until it happened? I have slept with a lot of women. Not once have I ever had someone who’s had any remote issue with this… actually quite the opposite: enthusiastically and often. Even have a fuck buddy right now that is a stark contrast.. unprompted: “I love sucking your cock and tasting you”. Just not in my frame, kind of at a loss here of how I should have covertly got there. I have also always got what I wanted sexually. Feel like If I had ever made the comment Adonis did last week about needing to fuck one of my girlfriends more they would just stand at attention and say “Yes sir” but I wouldn’t ask I’d just do it and maybe that’s the difference? We fuck all the time no hesitation… sometimes multiple times a day. No issue there and I enjoy that for sure. With Adonis you said that’s what a rapist does now you have a women who is neurotic about losing you and if she does blow me its going to be as if its not by choice. So how would I have tried to make it by choice? Is there anyway out of this gracefully besides forgetting the conversation ever happened?

Ate My Wheaties

Her: "You like my breasts do you?" You: "I don't know, let's see them." She's fucking with you, make yourself at least little bit of a challenge. She knows she can have you, so she doesn't need to. And yeah, you touched boob, echoing what stripper said, you sound 13.

Op Sec

About to have sex, in bed naked, wife unresponsive, so I zipped up and got up. Wife emotional, asked me to try again, ugh fine. This time I even managed to get hard but I eventually was losing my erection. Was about to exit the bed again. She was physically stopping me. Eventually got turned on enough to caveman. Then I went back to my (home) office to work. In a few minutes, she comes by my office crying. I walked her to the living room, grabbed a kleenex, wiped away some snot, she had nothing to say so I went back to work. I frequently get accused of smirking while she’s being emotional. I either STFU about it or disengage. I’ve been disengaging quite a bit lately and it is very effective. It doesn’t need to be my only move. When I get accused of smirking, next time I’ll own it. Same routine again, in bed naked, zipped up. Wife asked me to try again, all to get the same result. I left the house for a little while. When I got back, she wanted to try again, but this time sucked my dick. So that worked out. I was at the gym and started talking to an Instagram model. Asked about her tripod(old man opener). She seemed to be making an effort to be pleasant, in a good way. Plan is next time to qualify, “You seem really nice”. Then escalate, “I have to get back to my workout, you want to grab a coffee sometime . . . Give me your number”. A different girl that I had previously approached at the gym started chatting me up. Asking me mundane questions that go nowhere. I failed to show any interest. I acted like I had to go(which I did). Next time, I’ll try to grab her number too, maybe qualify her first. The next time I had sex, I had much less outcome dependence. After all, if the sex life is unsatisfactory, I’ll leave. Who is benefiting here when we have sex? Still ended up cave manning, as that was all there was on tap. Making dinner with wife in the evening. She’s pleasant. I think to myself oh this is nice. Then starts nagging, and then silent treatment. I ate dinner with her, and instead of spending the rest of the evening watching dinner with her (maybe an hour), I pulled out my switch and my headphones to wind down. When it was time for bed she started being pleasant again. I don’t like how reactive that was. I get the sense that I need to be more proactive and increase dread. Plan for the following week is to spend time during the day working from a cafe instead of the home office. I’ll also take some walks outside as I should be doing that anyway. Finished Richard Coopers book. It was meh, he’s really hung up on that single mother. I thought he was supposed to be about entrepreneurship. Also read Vertical Diet book, nice that it has some new ideas in this space. It addressed some digestive issues I was having.

Op Sec

Smashed a couple times Once morning she starts “complaining” about stuff. Comfort test.. I pretty much just fog and say “uhuh”, “yep” etc Then she’s like “fk me” but unfortunately logistics of kids got in the way

Fez

Called Cleaning Lady, let’s call her M to tidy up on Monday since I had a date on Tuesday. Originally this date was meant to be with her but she’s going on a 3 day trip to her family instead. She asked what I’m doing on Halloween now that she can’t and I told her I got a date. She became super curious with whom etc. Had some flirting and banter, then she cleaned my bedroom. She seemed super invested in making sure my date is successful lol but then THIS: I had no clean bedsheets anymore, washing would never dry until next day and so wanted to order new ones. She sat next to me on the bed, my cat assaulted her ass literally. I took the opportunity to check out her ass ( no resistance). We started to cuddle again and talk about sex, dreams for the future. Told her to lay on her belly ( wanted to massage her) and she resisted at first “because she’s so tense”). Told her to move exactly for that reason. She said she’ll go to a japanese massage therapist. I pushed two pressure points where I could see she was tense. She was surprised I found them. then I just took her flipped her around and started massaging her. She enjoyed it A LOT. Gave her full body massage. The we cuddled some more, she constantly said things like how great of a man I am she could fall asleep now, how crazy we are etc. I just agreed and continued. I toucher her under the shirt ( back) and she said :”Thanks for the massage but I’m good now” with a laugh. I said : “Yeah I know, this is for me now” NO resistance. She asked me if I find her attractive, said yes because otherwise I wouldn’t spend time cuddling and caressing her in my bed ( with a laugh). She also asked if I enjoy her proximity and presence and why. I said because I do. And she asked: “But why isn’t there anything else?” I said: “That’s it Ido enjoy it and that’s enough of a reason.” She also said “Don’t look at me like that” and when I laughingly asked how I’m looking at her she said “In love”. I laughed again and said: “Yeah no that’s def not it” Says we should get up , I agree and just stay put cuddling her. This happens a few times. By now her face is red and glowing hot ( not anger, she says iT’s hot in here”. She puts her hair down which was in a ponytail. “Look now it’s really long!” we go back to cuddling (spooning) and now she takes my hand and puts it on her boobs. I squeeze. Her: “YOu like my breasts do you?” Me : “Yeah I do” I start giving her kisses, no resistance, but she refuses kisses on her mouth. So, weird situation, lots of buffers, but didn’t matter touched boobs I guess lol. Question: What do I do here, what does this mean? Isn’t touching boobs more of an escalation than a kiss, especially if it comes from her? Other things she said: “You deserve a good woman” ( while looking down kinda guilty) “If this was a marriage ring what would you do”?( I know she isn’t married, and ignored the question) My plan would be 1 step forward two steps back and just be casual, friendly flirty as usual next time and see where it goes. I also suspect she feels bad because there are two guys in her life and she can’t decide between us. ONe guy is married but her first love and he can’t ler her go and she seems kinda hung up on him. Another guy who told her he can see a future with her but he’s ultra jealous. Thinks they are together but she doesn’t see it this way. Thanks in advance! PS the date I had was kinda botched XD The girl didn’t see it as a date and we didn’t even touch once. But it was useful like a pawn to get M closer apparently

Joyboy

Separate from legal issues. What are you working on? I'm seeing some "navel gazing" about SSRIs and whether they are--or--are not right for you. What's the next step goal. What you are you working on. What attractive issue/unattractive issue are you working on?

CovertContractAttorney

Stripper, I'll be honest. I want to use the line "what poor girl did you violate last night" for either my son or my daughter when they are of that age. No judgments.

CovertContractAttorney

All parties have [x] amount of days to respond to a legal filing. Read nothing into the delayed response other than the other side's lawyer is busy. If the other side's lawyer is delayed because he is busy, that suggests that they are competent and/or good at their job. Take that for what you will.

CovertContractAttorney

You can find a roommate and reduce monthly expenses. Also, i would expect legally that if your parents own most of your college debt that they cannot make you pay. So... Ignoring moral dimensions, you can ignore when deciding on places that you want. You do you of course.

CovertContractAttorney

SSRI's Last week's report led me to question some of my progress on learning and applying RP methods. The "frame of a zombie" comment got through to me. How stoic is too stoic? These fucking SSRI's got me to the point of non-reactiveness. Sure it has benefits, especially during divorce when you're even keeled enough not to choke out your wife's affair partner and deal with the consequences of that (jail, no child custody, etc) But as of right now I'm past those feelings and planning for my post-divorce life. IMO a red pilled man has a zest for life. The oak analogy applies. I'm not an oak. I'm a rock. A stubborn one at that. SSRI's take away all the feelz. My plan was to taper off, but it's been five days since taking a pill. I've decided I'm going to try cold turkey and keep white knuckling it. This led me to a path of searching the reddit for user reports on withdrawal, when to expect it, experiences from others trying cold turkey. Holy fuck, this drug is fucking a lot of people up. When I was prescribed, there was no ongoing treatment plan other than "keep taking them" and I gladly obliged because who am I to argue with a doctor, they know what they're doing, right? What info do they have other the subjective "are you feeling better?" Over the last two years my career kept growing in a positive direction and I've made some hefty increases in income while on SSRI's. I saw this as a big reason to justify staying on them. This morning my dick had some extra morning wood power that I haven't felt in awhile. Positive reinforcement. Divorce I had my ex served the divorce application. She sent an email about an hour after detailing how she's applying to get a masters degree so I can either wait for her to finish the masters application so she can earn more income and therefore I will be paying less child support, or we get divorced faster and I pay a larger child support check. She has 30 days to provide the courts an answer or I can continue to get the divorce granted. I can also pause the application at anytime, which is what she was indirectly asking me. My take on this is that she's lazy and doesn't want to spend time working on the divorce, and there is absolutely no guarantee she will earn more with a masters, or even get accepted. She's an ART major. I smell BS.

4thMostImportant

So here is what is what I have done since I last posted I finished the mystery method and from that realized along with what you said yeah I probably do need my own place if I want to be more effective. In order to do that I researched about the loans I have and my options, am I spending too much money, and where/when would it make sense to. I found out a majority of my loans are in parent direct loans. These are loans that are in my parent's name and affects their credit score. Effectively I legally would not have to pay them back since they aren't in my name if I choose to stop paying. Now I am not going to fuck over my parents because my goal isn't to move out as fast as possible. As a side note to all the parents in here don't get parent direct loans if you send a kid to college. If the relationship ever sours they could really screw over your credit and there is no way to hand them over to your kid unless they choose to consolidate them into a private loan. So here are my numbers: Student Loans Total: 167,747.82$ |4 loans| 1 in my name | 3 in my parents| Interest: 869.65$ a month Expected: 1023.32 a month currently/ max amount 1946.32/ increases by 72$ every 24 months up to the max amount If I want to move out I need to pay off 2 loans to lower this monthly expense to 468.1 a month these are the two loans I picked out to tackle first. Since the places that would support picking up chicks range from 1500$ to 2000$. Loans in my name 26,422$ Interest is: 109$ a month/5.05% expected: 267.87$ a month/ True amount 302.15 I can get rid of this in 1 year by paying 2,226.51$ a month Loans in my parents name: 49,505$ Interest: 289.60 a month /7% expected: 287.35$ a month/ true amount 575.30$ to pay off in 1.9 years : 2,050.38 a month This is where I was getting my 3 year figure from but looking at how much I spend I realized I was leaving money on the table. I spend about 1200$ to 1500$ a month which is a lot for guy without expenses. When I broke that down a lot of that was on stuff I can cut out, eating out and entertainment. I can add an extra 800$ to 1000$ to paying down the loans which lowers my time scale down to about 2 years(23 months) assuming I use my yearly bonus to pay down the loans. That's just by meal prepping breakfast and lunch so I don't buy it at work or eat out for dinner. On the getting da girls side of things I haven't done much to improve it. I bought some new clothes and used my dental insurance to start straightening my teeth. Outside of grooming I didn't actually get out into the field and practice game. My excuses I wrote down tended to be along the lines of if I don't have my own place what is the point of going out now since I can't get this to go to sex or I need to fix my finical situations before I think about getting laid? I did however find a group of guys to hangout with that aren't the nerdy type and that go out on the weekend. I haven't exchanged contact information with all of them but I have been out with them once and we had a good time so I have male friends now.

Flavor